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𝖘𝖍𝖆𝖉𝐲 𝖘𝖆𝖓𝖙𝖔𝖘 🦅

1 month ago

INTJ
Cancer

1w9

1

9

Do you think that there is Life after Death?
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31

103

Kelly

1 month ago

ENFP
Sagittarius

No, not at all. I think talking about life after death is often a distraction to make it easier to care less about what's happening in this life.

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5

36

Jathin

1 month ago

INFJ
Virgo

Yeah actually

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1

0

𝖘𝖍𝖆𝖉𝐲 𝖘𝖆𝖓𝖙𝖔𝖘 🦅

1 month ago

INTJ
Cancer

1w9

1

9

I wouldn't necessarily call it a distraction. Believing in it doesn't necessarily mean that you'll focus on it so much that you lose sight of what currently goes on in Life

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1

1

Kelly

1 month ago

ENFP
Sagittarius

Yes, I meant more like when people are talking and/or thinking about it all the time. Especially if they're spending time trying to convince others.

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0

1

𝖘𝖍𝖆𝖉𝐲 𝖘𝖆𝖓𝖙𝖔𝖘 🦅

1 month ago

INTJ
Cancer

1w9

1

9

Well I wouldn't call it a waste of time.. I prefer people who do that then those who treat people bad or something like that. And i can fully understand that those who try to convince anyone can come of being annoying but they're just trying to do something good. (In they're eyes)

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1

1

Kelly

1 month ago

ENFP
Sagittarius

Yes I definitely prefer being around someone who is involved with distractions vs someone who treats people bad!

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0

0

Josh

1 month ago

INFJ
Virgo

5w4

5

4

Warmly disagree. In NDEs, the majority of experiencers receive the message that life is about learning to love and I can promise it is the opposite of a distraction because it brings awareness and presence to things in our own lives and through the eyes and even thoughts and feelings of others who we have showed love to or have hurt with intentionally or indirectly and we learn to live with more love in our actions. Small acts of kindness are the best things like a passing smile or wave. You never know who needs it. We are all living the illusion that we are separate through the ego but in the presence of the light, we are all loved equally. This all means that our lives are purposeful and we have more impact than we at times realize and we are here to learn and grow. As infinite beings, we already know within ourselves this is true, so we come here to experience through the physical. According to NDE research, we shed ego becoming fully aware and even have an immediate detachment from our human experience. Time becomes limitless as well while we experience 360-degree vision not having eyes locked inside a skull. Often, hardcore atheists experience NDEs and their perspectives are shifted forever but ultimately they learn to live in love and I don't mean new age love and light. I mean real love with intention and no spiritual arrogance.

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0

1

Kelly

1 month ago

ENFP
Sagittarius

Where are you getting these facts? People have NDEs all the time without a spiritual experience. I agree it's important to bring awareness and presence to things in our own lives. I agree we should look through the eyes of others and consider their thoughts and feelings. But you don't need an afterlife for any of that. In fact, many people are waiting for the next life, trusting God will take care of people on earth, instead of doing what they can to fight for greater justice and fix the world right now.

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0

1

Josh

1 month ago

INFJ
Virgo

5w4

5

4

Not all NDEs are STEs just as the reverse is also true but the majority who have transformative NDEs have a profound sense of unconditional love for their being, are typically shown not just what I mentioned but are able to feel and experience others hurt or joy and are made aware that all of us are intertwined and constantly evolving spiritually while in a physical form. It is the vehicle to navigate our 3D. Either way, these experiences aren't specifically for that. The afterlife itself is an entirely different experience than a corporeal existence. NDEs that are transformative very often drive people to begin selflessly committing to volunteering and helping their communities or finding ways to bring the awareness of that infinite love to others in the physical. They are sometimes guided to places, positions or even specific people to help or share with that brings them into more of the same awareness and that creates a ripple effect. So in a sense, the problems of our world here and now and how we perceive them are not nearly as pressing in the same way we see it here and not simply because we would be deceased. I am not an authority in the field and only study it but I do know this regarding the phenomena: NDEs very typically relay the message whether it be positive or distressing that the experiencer and everyone alive have very certain purposes (which some have fallen away from mistakenly and become selfish or uncaring) that we are here for and that is why some are told it is not their time and are returned almost unwillingly to the density of physical awareness. I think a good example are the miraculous survival of certainly lethal circumstances be it a gunshot or surgery or sickness. I understand your reasoning, though. NDEs do not suggest that we shouldn't still care about our lives and in fact the opposite. Life is a gift but death is an illusion and merely a transition but in this time and space, we have the ability to unknow what we knew and have the experience to test our higher self-awareness and become love in the world but injustice, suffering, and so forth are all a part of the experience. Without an obstacle to overcome, life is built on the mundane; unable to evolve and transcend to anything higher. As Bukowski put it; "What matters is how well we walk through the fire."

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0

1

Kelly

1 month ago

ENFP
Sagittarius

I guess I haven't seen any compelling evidence that death is an illusion. Near death experiences seem well-explained by brain chemistry.

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0

1

Josh

1 month ago

INFJ
Virgo

5w4

5

4

Well explained by what brain chemistry? In Dr. Eben Alexander's report, an atheist to remind you, he had a rare meningitis that shut his entire brain down. Completely dark. No activity. His colleagues dismissed his claims but he insisted his experience was ineffable by modern medicine and began to challenge the model.

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0

1

Kelly

1 month ago

ENFP
Sagittarius

I'm not a neurologist. But as one example, NDEs don't seem particularly different from other brain phenomena like seizures, hallucinations, sleep paralysis, etc.

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0

1

Josh

1 month ago

INFJ
Virgo

5w4

5

4

I'm not either but I am aware of some in the field through NDE study that would say otherwise. In fact just what I DO knos, I can say that those things are of a biological nature and can be recorded by an EEG of which I have a history of whereas an NDE can not be measured in such a way because of clinical death.

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0

1

Kelly

1 month ago

ENFP
Sagittarius

Yes, but in your brain a whole dream can happen in a moment.

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0

1

Josh

1 month ago

INFJ
Virgo

5w4

5

4

For sure. The brain is definitely interesting but I believe there is a lot of evidence to support that it is only the vehicle for consciousness and not necessarily the root for it. Once you understand we are energy and energy can not be destroyed then you can likely accept that the human form is only animated by that energy and that is a belief in most religion and spirituality. If energy can't be destroyed and it goes somewhere after death then we must also go with it since we are it and are not the body itself.

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0

1

Kelly

1 month ago

ENFP
Sagittarius

I don't believe life is energy. It always includes energy but there is energy that is not life. Life is something that reproduces. A living organism seems more like a system, like a tornado. When the tornado is gone its effects are still there but the system is over. It no longer exists. So if you mean that all our parts continue to exist, I agree. If you mean the system that is Josh or Kelly continues to exist, I disagree because there is no evidence of that.

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0

2

Josh

1 month ago

INFJ
Virgo

5w4

5

4

I mean, I agree, the system that is me or you does not continue but I am saying that our consciousness doesn't make up our system. The system being the biological organism we inhabit. There is plenty of evidence to suggest consciousness goes beyond the brain. What we think and feel as a personality actually still exists but it becomes much more integrated, whole and aware while being less constrained in density. I'm seeing a bit of overlap in what you're saying. To imply energy is not life seems contradictory to me as it takes energy to create or destroy anything and something creates that tornado as much as the tornado itself destroys though the difference is it lacks any intention. Intention is different and comes with consciousness but it is all energy. I think you are referring to the cause and effects of life simply being life but it does not remove it from all still being energy. The cause and effect of life can't be without energy behind it.

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0

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Josh

1 month ago

INFJ
Virgo

5w4

5

4

Medical science is stuck in the Newtonian concept of the universe is matter but quantum physics suggest the universe is energy on the deepest level, so it would conclude that life itself is in fact energy. Consciousness is energy.

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0

1

Kelly

1 month ago

ENFP
Sagittarius

You keep saying there's lots of evidence but my issue is I haven't seen any evidence that is compelling. Can you point me to some of this evidence?

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0

1

Josh

1 month ago

INFJ
Virgo

5w4

5

4

Absolutely. Give me a bit to finish a project.

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1

1

Kelly

1 month ago

ENFP
Sagittarius

I appreciate that. This is a topic that greatly interests me. But I will warn you that I have a high standard for evidence for anything I believe.

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1

2

Josh

1 month ago

INFJ
Virgo

5w4

5

4

"The professional near-death literature contains multiple reports of veridical perception of phenomena that were outside the range of the NDEr's sensory perception and, therefore, of brain mediation (Ring & Cooper, 1997; Ring & Lawrence, 1993; Sabom, 1982; Sharp, 1995; van Lommel, van Wees, Meyers, & Elfferich, 2001). In some cases, these perceptions occurred while the NDEr apparently was experiencing the brain inactivity that follows within 10 seconds of cessation of heartbeat (van Lommel et al., 2001). Over 100 such cases are published on www.iands.org, www.nderf.org, and www.oberf.org. Further discussion of veridical perception is presented in the article titled "Does the Arousal System Contribute to Near-Death Experience?: A Response" under review for the Journal of Near-Death Studies. Taken together, the evidence suggests strongly the possibility that near-death OB perception might occur without the mediation of the physical senses or the brain." Ring, K., & Cooper, S. (1997). Near-death and out-of-body experiences in the blind: A study of apparent eyeless vision. Journal of Near-Death Studies, 16(2), 101-147. Ring, K., & Lawrence, M. (1993). Further evidence of veridical perception during near-death experiences. Journal of Near-Death Studies, 11(4), 223-229. Sabom, M. B. (1982). Recollections of death: A medical investigation. New York: Simon & Schuster. Sabom, M. (1998). Light and Death: One doctor’s fascinating account of near-death experiences. Grand Rapids, MI: Zondervan. Sharp, K. C. (1995). After the light: The spiritual path to purpose. New York: Avon. Van Lommel, P., van Wees, R., Meyers, V., & Elfferich, I. (2001). Near-death experience in survivors of cardiac arrest: A prospective study in the Netherlands. Lancet, 358, 2039-2045.

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