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Manahil
Manahil

3mo

ENTP

Scorpio

2
3

Is God Real?

I'm pretty sure this is one of the longest arguments since ancient philosophy. People who are unaware of how philosophical arguments work, you need to have a logical basis for anything you say. You can't just say "Ah, the bible says-" because that isn't exactly believable for a person who doesn't believe in a God or the bible. For them bible could be a book written out of delulu of an ancient person. The same goes for counter argument "I can't see God, si not real!" You can't see many things in the universe but they exist. You literally see dead stars, your eyes aren't a great argument. Even witness eye testimonies are questionable. Your argument needs to be based in reasoning or science. [Also remember that most of these arguments are for and against a Monotheistic God. More over, they are specifically for a All merciful, All powerful, All seeing and All loving God] So, the argument will always be this first thing you learn in Philosophy because it's one of the biggest and ongoing debates. Now, I'll bring you some of the points and statements made over the years, remember this is purely for debate and not your personal belief. It's just an interesting topic, I don't give a hoot what anyone believes. The Analogous argument: This argument believes that the universe is analogous, as in everything comes from something or in "order and regularity", say the existence of an artifact such as a watch or a wooden chair justifies the presumption of the watchmaker or the wood worker. The Cosmological argument comes from Thomas Aquinas found on (my least favourite source) Britannica. The cosmological argument, which appeals to the notion of causation to conclude either that there is a first cause or that there is a necessary being from whom all contingent beings derive their existence. In Laymen's terms god must exist for the universe to exist as cause and effect is a law of nature. Continueing on; Something must come first as the first being and the primary mover to begin the universe and lead it to it's end as there needs to be a cause for the effect of universe. This cause, Aquinas said, is God. This theory actually then started another argument on the assumption that if God is real, is it One God, Multiple Gods OR if any of those beings or being are Omnipotent and Omniscient. (Just an FYI, One of my favourite quotes drives from here: If God is omniscient and good, he cannot be omnipotent. If God is omnipotent and good, he cannot be omniscient. If God is both Omniscient and Omnipotent, God is not good. It's to say, that if God knows all and can control all, then there should not be such atrocities in the world) St. Anselm's ontological argument "God, by definition, is that for which no greater can be conceived. God exists in the understanding. If God exists in the understanding, we could imagine Him to be greater by existing in reality. Therefore, God must exist." (This is the most Schrödinger's cat theory I've seen in my life ISTG) Anyway, back to topic. This is a complicated matter and there have been many many theories that oust the ones before. Let's look at some theories that are against the existence of God now: Evil: (I love how dramatic the name is) This argument is simple. Evil exists and is rampant, if evil exists, there cannot be a all powerful, all loving and all merciful God that many monotheist religions perpetuate. How can evil exist if God exists? If God is all powerful he does not need the Existence of Evil. Injustice: If there is an all powerful and all seeing God, why is he not Just? Why are the rich richer and the poor, poorer? Why is there no innate justice. Why are newborns dying, why is there war caused by the powerful that destroy the weak? We thought God has a design but the Earth is dying due to injustice. Municipality There are many religions of many kinds, all religions cannot be true at once, all powerful single God cannot be true from each religion. All religions must be false or there must me multiple Gods. The most popular argument against an Omniscient and Omnipotent God is: The "Argument from Free Will" or the "Paradox of Free Will": Free will cannot be possible if God is Omniscient and Omnipotent. There are philosophers that argued against the for "Evil" argument by saying that God allows evil because allowing free will is the "greater good", this makes God both omniscient and omnipotent but from Free Will argues that how is God "Good", omniscient, omnipotent and also able to allow evil when all religions also believe in fate and that everything that is happening is written in "fate" by God, (otherwise known as theological fatalism). This was just a short peek into this centuries long argument, but it's very interesting and ongoing.

Is God Real?

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Emereda Phantomhive
Emereda Phantomhive

3mo

INFJ

I used to date an atheist and he also asked me why I believe in God so much if He doesn’t exist. So I told him these. Let’s go back to the root, as someone who grew up with religious family in a religious country. Islamic religious teachings are so important in my country that regardless of any religion or atheists you still need to learn them and that includes reading Arabic letters so we’re able to read some Surah from the Qoran and Hadits. I also study the bible at the church when I was young. Since I study both religions at the same time, I used to be so confused and keep questioning myself which God is real and does God do exist? Why do we have to obey His orders? So I tried to pray to God and connect myself to him through prayers and that was when I started to feel His presence up till now. I can feel Him communicating with me. Despite that, since I’m a realist who loves sciences, without logical reason or evidences or proof I will not believe something. But the presence of God is clear, not just stated in the book but also in the nature and environment. It’s clear that His name is written everywhere just need to open the blinded eyes and seek for it and think logically why His name was written in the first place. God has shown so many signs of His presence through nature, phenomenon. The nature itself believe in God. Animals, they respect the holy books. Religious teachings are much more easier to understand than science, if I would say. I also read mythologies such as Greek, Egyptian, Buddhism and etc etc. They’re so much similarities in all religions, they believe in God. Why do you think and how do you think people in the past might came up with these? Just that, in Christianity and Islam, there is only one God. For example the Big Bang which happened billions of years ago are already stated in the holy books before scientists discovered it. Do they make sense?😅😅 I don’t know what I’m talking about already. Just ask again if my explanation is still unclear

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5

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Michael
Michael

3mo

INTP

Capricorn

9
1

To be clear, I do believe in a higher being, but not a specific one, or omniscient I’d like to believe there is one is because the laws of the universe such as gravity, life, and sentience are so meticulously created where if it were off by even the smallest margin, things wouldn’t exist as it was, so to orchestrate the creation of the universe would require an infinitely perfect precision. As for the arguments for whether the arguments against the existence, I’d like to believe everything was made as an experiment for entertainment or out of curiosity, *similar* to someone playing a simulation game where anything can happen. This would explain why free will was implemented, why god will not take action for injustice, and also for the existence for evil. Whether or not all I am correct or not, I will never know, but this is what I reasonably believe. Note: I would like to note some inspiration came from that one episode of Young Sheldon where Sheldon talked about the existence of god to his mother. (edited)

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4

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No
No

3mo

INTJ

Sagittarius

6
5

1. We can observe order and regularity and therefore it might be our perception purely. Therefore we attribute our perception to a being that (we imagine ) would have the same kind of mental faculties as us. 2. What is needed as a cause for the god to exist then? 2.1 -evil is also a human notion derived from personsl experience. 3. This is very close to a lot of stipulated theories of existence - if a perfect dragon exists he by definition is the greatest of beings . If a dragon greater than god exists - his existence is validated by simply thinking about him - therefore a dragon is the highest form of existence (for now -until someone thinks of something higher-because in this case the theoretical argument creates reality) 4. Once again evil is perceived by the one suffering 5. There is no injustice- just the want of ego and natiral circumstances and social norms 6. All religions are philosophical constructs therefore are not perfect snd might be faulty interpretations of the same occurrence 7. If time is linear then free will ended his omnipotence If time is not linear - free will is a part of gods mind- therefore all consciousness could be it / him P.s. I don’t think there is free will It’s not very interesting and the arguments are trivial snd have purely speculative basis.

1

12

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Tim
Tim

3mo

INFP

Capricorn

As it says in my profile, there’s more evidence of aliens existing than god.

1

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Arvind
Arvind

3mo

INTJ

Aries

5
4

All these theories are based on speculation or some form of feeling and can not be proven with experiments and certainty.. If someone says they feel the presence of God, how do we know it is God and not your bodily sensation - not some supernatural trying to communicate with you.. Also, the idea of good and evil is all man-made.. so people have projected God, if there is one, to be a certain way, without any proof that God is in fact that way.. We have created God in our minds like Unicorns, Phoenix, dragons, etc. All this does not mean that God does not exist.. but the argument that there has to be a cause for an effect is a notion of existing physics, which may or may not apply in the past... Also if God is the first mover, who created God.. its an endless cycle of question that can not be answered with certainty.. Also, the God of the organised religions might be completely different from the one that actually exists.. There are too many possibilities without any highly probable answers. What we need are experiments that help us answer these questions, which can be reproducible and designed to prove God's existence.. My biggest gripe with followers of organised religion is that they are very oblivious to how our social systems have created injustices for many marginalised groups and continue to destroy our environment.. They are too obsessed with their religion that they do not open their eyes to the realities of the world and might think this as God's will instead of some bad actors benefiting from their power.. Also if a believer is in power, they tend to believe their actions are God's will.. be it terrorists, dictators, politicians, a priest, etc. The moment one gives power to someone in the name of God, they are giving away their free will and morality that they might think are God's gift.. Hope people stay curious and continue learning about the world without losing themselves to the supernatural... Apart from that, organised religion has been a force of good and gives a sense of purpose and community for many, so its very shortsighted to try to prove God's non-existence.. (edited)

0

3

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Daniel
Daniel

3mo

INTP

I don’t know. Without a clear idea about what we are talking about, it seems difficult if not impossible to answer. It means different things to different people. It faces the same challenge as when people ask is love real. It is not clear what exactly they mean even if I have some conception of the term.

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